Vintage VE2000GG 12 string - my experience

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Re: Vintage VE2000GG 12 string - my experience

Postby Oldbones » Fri Mar 14, 2014 3:45 pm

BRC wrote:Your comments on the condition of display at Ivor Mairants is of concern

Ye Gods!!!!
That wouldn't now be my only concern.
I was just browsing for some reviews of Gordon's signature 12 string and saw Ivor Mairants advertising it at £529
Reidys price is £339
DJM price is £30 more - but still way off Mairants' price.

What do they have - a gold-plated version and a hardcase lined with white mink?

This looks to me like a SERIOUS case of visiting, trying and then buying online or from somewhere that's one heck of a lot cheaper.

Here's hoping they have a 'Price Promise' for anyone who ventures through their doors.
It isn't how fast you can play that counts - it's that you only play as fast as you need to play that is important.
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Re: Vintage VE2000GG 12 string - my experience

Postby BRC » Fri Mar 14, 2014 7:09 pm

Oldbones,

I had a feeling you might be posting a comment as I checked Ivor Mairants website around 15:30 today.

That is a definite 'ouch' and wonder whether I have been instrumental (skates quickly passed the pun) with the number of mentions I have given them in this thread. As you have quite properly pointed out there are other retailers offering a much lower price, such as Reidy's at £359 and DJM Music at £369. Having mentioned them, let's see if their prices change.

When I first considered this guitar around two years ago the price, I think, was about £529, and had it not been for a large Vet bill (well the bill was normal size though demanding a large amount of money) I would have bought it. The only other contender for me in the sub £1200 price range was the Martin DX12AE at just over the £600 mark. I would not have felt cheated at those prices and, still, believe both are excellent value for the quality - better than anything in that sub £1200 bracket and some above that.

However, being completely realistic and still waiting for a big lottery win to let me indulge in fantasy spending on musical instruments, there is no sense in not going for the cheaper option (should I have said 'lower priced'?). I would not think this makes any difference to Gordon in terms of any involvement in sales, though I am sure he will comment if he feels it appropriate.

I now have a busy three days - one socially, one football wise and one musically - so will have to curtail my contributions until next week. I liked your listing of various guitars and will compile a profile of what I have had over the years and, if I can remember, what they cost. There is no problem for the last 12 years as I maintain a spreadsheet for insurance purpose.

Have a good weekend (have I spelled that right?).

Brad

Have a good weekend

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Re: Vintage VE2000GG 12 string - my experience

Postby Oldbones » Sat Mar 15, 2014 8:46 am

BRC wrote:there are other retailers offering a much lower price, such as Reidy's at £359 and DJM Music at £369. Having mentioned them, let's see if their prices change.

As far as I recall, £529 was pretty well the original asking price for the GG and although a few dealers still list that, there are a great meany who now offer the guitar with its case at sub £400.

My experiences with Reidys go back quite a way and I nearly always find that their prices are lowest WITH next day delivery when you order online. I once also had cause to take them up on their 'Price Promise' when I bought a small Stagg 10w practice amp. Their price was £10 more than another seller, but they lived up to their offer. I have no vested interest in them beyond always looking to them first when thinking of buying some new kit ..... just as I have a shortlist of affiliate sellers on Amazon whom I always look for first when buying books, CDs or DVDs.

To return to the origins of this thread - I'm hoping soon to have a chance to do my own side-by-side comparison of the PB and GG 12 strings ... or at least to try them within a few days of each other. At present, my main interest has shifted slightly in favour of the GG, but the fact that the PB 12 has been designed from the outset as a twelve string rather than as an adaptation of an existing 6 string is still making me uncertain.

Enjoy your hectic 3 days. We are hopefully going to have the opposite after a past month during which my wife had to have daily sessions of radiotherapy (after a recent period of unpleasant chemo). At least we now have about 2 weeks before anything new has to happen.

All the best.
It isn't how fast you can play that counts - it's that you only play as fast as you need to play that is important.
Silence can be as eloquent as sound.

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Re: Vintage VE2000GG 12 string - my experience

Postby Oldbones » Mon Mar 17, 2014 5:40 pm

BRC wrote:I finally made the leap and ordered a new VE2000GG 12 string guitar, which arrived yesterday afternoon.

Brad - I forgot to ask: Could you do me a small favour and measure the width across the strings at the nut and the saddle (not just the width of the complete nut or saddle).

I spent a happy few hours today touring Youtube for uploads of 12 string players and grabbed a lot of GREAT music as mp3s. (Not guily about tht as none of the examples were ripped tracks off CDs). What quickly became apparent was that whereas there are several demos of the PB12, the GG12 makes only one really noticeable appearance on YT - and, ironically, that's the demo by Paul Brett!

I'm hopeful - well, a bit hopeful - of finding examples of both the PB12 and GG12 within striking distance of where I live so that can try them out before I make that final decision. But if that plan fails, it will all have to come down to studying the various magazine reviews I downloaded from the Vintage website and then watching and re-watching the YT demos.

I'm assuming you are still ticketty-boo and chuffed with your VE2000GG?
Have you yet had the chance to try th Paul Brett 12?
I wonder if anyone else has - maybe it would be worth posting an enquiry as a separate thread?

Hope you had a good weekend.
It isn't how fast you can play that counts - it's that you only play as fast as you need to play that is important.
Silence can be as eloquent as sound.

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Re: Vintage VE2000GG 12 string - my experience

Postby BRC » Mon Mar 17, 2014 8:44 pm

Oldbones,

Just got back from a very enjoyable rehearsal and looked in on the website and, clearly found your latest posting. So, the technical information first:

Width across strings (1st to 12th or the other way round)
at the nut = 51mm
at the saddle 59mm

I have had the same sort of hits for demo of the Ve2000GG 12 string so ..... Gordon, any chances of a demo by you, a very nice 'please'?

I had a try of the 6 string version and was impressed with that, though the 12 string seemed to be very elusive until recently. One shop did offer to get one for me. Sadly I lost my trust in the shop a good few years ago on ordering when they failed to get a replacement tuner/machine head for the Faith Jupiter Eclipse I had at the time. I had to go to the importers, Barnes Mullin, who were extremely helpful and supplied 2 completely free of charge. This meant having to make a leap of faith in getting the 12 string version, untried, and only heard in the Paul Brett and a few other demos. It wasn't a big leap of faith as I don't believe Gordon would give his name to a signature guitar without being totally convinced it was of appropriate quality , or Rob Armstrong allow his name to be shown as the designer. I am as distrusting as the next man, and some would same more cynical, however I feel I have been on reasonably safe grounds on making this purchase.

Yes I am 'still ticketty-boo and chuffed', over the moon and tickled pink (okay, maybe not that last one as it doesn't make sense) with my VE2000GG. I even picked up on your comments on the Shubb capo so ordered one Friday, received today and successfully tried - good call. I haven't had a Shubb capo for well over 14 years now as I have been pleased with the Kyser units, for both 6 and 12 string so didn't really enter my head to try one for the new 12 stringer. The Kysers are fine but can become a little cumbersome in placing on a 12 string. The Shubb is certainly a good fit - tried right up to the 9th fret. I need a capo for my 5 string banjo so might go for a Shubb on that too.

I didn't take the Vintage with me to the rehearsal today as I hurt my left wrist (don't ask), just below the thumb, on Friday and the additional pressure required on a 12 string would not have helped the recovery process - the bruising is starting to develop a nice rainbow colour!

I shall be having my day in London in early April - I don't put dates in open forum postings to avoid giving too much personal information, unless the date has passed, but it will be sooner rather than later. I will give an update on whether or not I was able to try a Paul Brett 12 stringer as soon as possible after that day. Good idea on a possible separate thread. I was also thinking of starting a thread on 'My guitars what I have had'. You have already given some information about yours and it might be interesting for others to add their 'guitar history' - good, bad or indifferent, there is still a story to tell. What do you think on that? I am sure Gordon could contribute on his Elvis Presley starter guitar (I am almost certain he has referred to that on at least one occasion).

I must curtail my ramblings as my wife will think I have left home, or at least I hope it is not 'wish' instead of 'think'.

Brad
P.S. Please note I have not used the names of any retail outlets in this posting.

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Re: Vintage VE2000GG 12 string - my experience

Postby GORDON » Mon Mar 17, 2014 10:56 pm

Hi guys.

I think the wonderful Sue Holton has supplied you with a YOUTUBE link to me playing the GG 12 string .Worth a look maybe?

I rarely play the 12 string these days.Maybe I should get round to writing something new for it.

As good as my signature model sounds,I still can't praise the Paul Brett model high enough,and as someone pointed out,this is a purpose built 12 string and NOT just a 12 string version of a 6 string.

Thanks for your interest .

G.

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Re: Vintage VE2000GG 12 string - my experience

Postby Oldbones » Tue Mar 18, 2014 9:15 am

To save posting two separate responses, I'll cover both Gordon's comments and Brad's in one go -

GORDON wrote:I think the wonderful Sue Holton has supplied you with a YOUTUBE link to me playing the GG 12 string .Worth a look maybe?

More than 'maybe' Gordon. For anyone else following this thread who missed Sue's response to a separate query that I posted, this is the link. It's great to see Gordon playing one of his classic tunes on the Vintage 12:

http://youtu.be/stv9xJyo3ME

GORDON wrote:I rarely play the 12 string these days.Maybe I should get round to writing something new for it.

Or even just recording one or two more 'classics'. It would be especially interesting to see and hear you play one of your 'softer' compositions or arrangements on the Vintage - such as you recorded for your wonderful 'Midnight clear' LP/CD.

GORDON wrote:As good as my signature model sounds, I still can't praise the Paul Brett model high enough...

For me, that comment typifies why you're so admired, Gordon. And not just for your playing.
Without getting too huggy-huggy, kiss-on-the-cheekish, your generosity of spirit in so openly lauding particular strengths of an instrument which bears the signature of someone else, clearly stands as testament to your openness of mind and attitude to life.

GORDON wrote:...as someone pointed out, this is a purpose built 12 string and NOT just a 12 string version of a 6 string.

That was possibly me, although once you start digging into the specs, it's clearly stated and explained.

========================================================================================


BRC wrote:the technical information first:
at the nut = 51mm
at the saddle 59mm

Thanks Brad. I want to compare against guitars I already have to better estimate how well my left-hand problem might be able to cope with a 12 string smaller than my dreadnought Crafter.

BRC wrote:I have had the same sort of hits for demo of the Ve2000GG 12 string so ..... Gordon, any chances of a demo by you, a very nice 'please'?

See above for the link Sue sent me.

BRC wrote:I had a try of the 6 string version and was impressed with that, though the 12 string seemed to be very elusive until recently.

Frustratingly, I have TWO shops near where I live which sell Vintage guitars. The one is a small concern and, sensibly, they mostly stock a range of instruments that will appeal to, and be affordable by, the pupils who attend all the local primary and upper schools. The other shop which is only 25 minutes drive-time away is one I wouldn't give the time of day to (let alone money) as the owner/manager has a ghastly reputation for being unfriendly and unhelpful. I experienced this once myself a few years back, so although I now regularly look at the shop window display, I wouldn't dream of stepping inside. (I've never seen evidence of either the Vintage PB12 nor the GG12 in the window or inside the shop anyway). Heaven alone knows how or why he stays in business .... maybe just so he can play upon the instruments that he stocks?

BRC wrote:I even picked up on your comments on the Shubb capo so ordered one Friday, received today and successfully tried - good call.

Capos for 6 strings are rarely a problem as long as you buy a reputable make and not one of those cheap clones, but capos for 12 strings can be tricky. On my Crafter 12 I found that the G7th and Kyser capos weren't as effective as the Shubb. On the Crafter, if I place the Shubb halfway between frets instead of close behind a fret, the detuning effect is minimal. But as I said before - capos and player preferences are very individual things.

BRC wrote:I hurt my left wrist (don't ask), just below the thumb, on Friday

I broke my right wrist some years ago but that is no longer a problem despite not having set in quite the right position. My problem is that damaged index finger on my left hand, so now I have a rather strange playing style which favours the middle finger as 'lead'. Chords are often difficult because the left index finger can land in the wrong place and/or impact on adjacent strings so that they're muted or partially fretted. I thus often play with that finger 'floating' high so it's out of the way.

BRC wrote:I will give an update on whether or not I was able to try a Paul Brett 12 stringer as soon as possible after that day. Good idea on a possible separate thread.

It will interesting to read if you end up in a position to write it.
I've started a thread for anyone who is able to directly comment on both the PB12 and the GG12.

========================================================================================


I've just started another new thread where members might like to post details, dates and venues for any guitar fairs scheduled to take place in their area. Near me, there will be an acoustic fair this coming Sunday (March 23rd) so that will be my best chance to try the PB abd GG 12 strings ... I hope.
It isn't how fast you can play that counts - it's that you only play as fast as you need to play that is important.
Silence can be as eloquent as sound.

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VE2000GG 12 string - my experience update

Postby BRC » Thu Apr 03, 2014 8:50 pm

What follows is not for those of a delicate disposition.

My experience with the VE2000GG 12 string has continued to be an absolute pleasure in playing it. I used it extensively on Monday, 31st March, in the rehearsals for the annual music event that I organise ..... however, on concluding the session I started to clear the various guitar and music stands when the one the VE2000GG-12 was on toppled over and crashed to the ground, with the guitar turning as it fell, crashing on to the metal upright with the upper face. This all happened in apparent extreme slow motion but so was I and unable to prevent the fall.

The result is that the upper right side (as you look at the front) of the face of the guitar has split from the shoulder to the sound hole approximately 8mm in from the neck. This is almost exactly parallel to the neck all the way. After cursing myself for not being quick enough I checked the guitar over fully and there does not appear to be any other damage. It stills plays as before though the split, which to my eyes can appear anything from a thin line to a massive chasm, does not appear to have compromised the structure elsewhere. It has definitely compromised my heart beat rate.

This was all rather upsetting though I only have myself to blame for using an old guitar stand that logic dictates should have been disposed of years ago. Once the nerves and sanity had settled into a tranquil seethe I checked my home contents insurance policy. A phone call was duly made to my insurers and , with the minimum of fuss and the maximum of sympathy, they duly agreed that the instrument should be treated as a write-off for which they would send me a cheque in settlement (minus my £100 excess) of the full purchase price. I queried whether they wished me to provide them with a receipt for the original price and let them have the instrument. The very surprising reply to both points was 'no' and the instrument was mine to dispose of as I saw fit.

This put me in something of a dilemma as to what I should do about a replacement, though not for long as I was quite happy to put my money where my mouth is, courtesy of a sizeable chunk from the insurers. I therefore ordered a new VE2000GG-12 from a business in Blackburn (you know who they are, Oldbones).

I had better shorten this a little, so, I ordered the replacement guitar Monday evening, that arrived about 15:35 Wednesday 2 April, and, very surprisingly, the insurers cheque arrived at just after 11:00 that same day.

I have contacted a luthier about possible repair to the first guitar - he seems confident that he can do this - though await his fuller appraisal after emailing photographs of the damaged instrument. What I do with it after that I shall have to give further thought to very carefully.

If you have stayed with this unfortunate horror story you can now relax. What it has brought me to do is buy a better guitar stand to replace the offending one which has now been consigned to scrap metal. I have mentioned what I consider poor customer care elsewhere in response to an Oldbones posting (he does seem to have been prolific of late) but am delighted with that care in resolving this mishap, from my insurers and the Blackburn music shop. I shall write to both of them later in the week when I have recovered from the traumatic event recounted above.

Brad
P.S. Other than the scratches and minor dents/bumps that are expected over the years this is the first time in over 50 years of owning guitars that such a thing has happened to me. I am hoping I can get away without such misfortune for another 50 years.

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Re: Vintage VE2000GG 12 string - my experience

Postby Oldbones » Fri Apr 04, 2014 9:24 am

Thank heavens it wasn't the belly that started to separate or the tension on the bridge could well have escalated things rather dramatically - and drastically! I'm assuming you had the guitar downtuned, so that would have helped prevent a greater shock to the top. Still nasty but I'm glad all tuned out well as regards insurance and ordering a replacement.

Some years ago I had an old but unexpectedly playable Encore version of an Ovation. When bought, part of one side had been pierced and had split. Being an expert luthier (not!!!) I repaired it with a patch made from a strip of pond-liner and some epoxy. It worked perfectly!

Right - today's the day.
I've decided to stop deferring and will aim to make a final decision about which guitar (PB or GG 12) to order.
As I said elsewhere - I'll let you know what I decide and will eventually upload a full review.

As for me posting quite a few replies and threads recently - I thought I'd try to kickstart a few additional discussions. Maybe whatever I write by way of a guitar review will help? Must say, though, this is a very quiet forum. Or perhaps I just gab too much???
It isn't how fast you can play that counts - it's that you only play as fast as you need to play that is important.
Silence can be as eloquent as sound.

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Re: Vintage VE2000GG 12 string - my experience

Postby BRC » Fri Apr 04, 2014 10:50 am

I am now looking forward to your final decision. I certainly don't have any regrets about my choice - albeit twice!

I am still awaiting a response form the luthier as to his appraisal of effective repair and cost. My options if I have it properly repaired is to see if I can sell it at a price to recover the £100 excess on insurance plus repair cost, alternatively offer it to my eldest son, gratis. I am not vey keen on entering into the selling market as that is a side of life I have never felt comfortable with; I have given away a few guitars over my lifetime, once I have upgraded/replaced the relevant instrument. I feel better that an instrument goes to someone who wants to learn to play but hasn't quite plucked up the courage to buy a good enough guitar. I have only ever sold one guitar - a 1972 Yamaha FG180 - and that because of its history having a value beyond that of the guitar (I asked and had my hand snatched-of for a nominal £10).

I shall await the outcome of repair enquiries but am under no pressure now I have the replacement. I just have to go through the settling down process again. I agree your comment on the 'good fortune' that it wasn't the belly - and, yes, I do down tune a full tone. As I have said elsewhere the only 12 string I trust to tune to full pitch is the Ovation, which is a very well built tank like build.

As an aside to a comment I made on another of your posts I have broached the subject of a baritone guitar with my wife and that now looks like a possibility over the coming months. Her main comment was "you will have to get rid of one of the other guitars to make room". Maybe the Euromillions will send some help my way to enable us to buy a bigger house instead - I can but dream.

My comments about your 'prolific' post were very much tongue-in-cheek. After seeing your comments on my review on Amazon I was very tempted to suggest you might be' stalking' me, though thought that could be taken far too seriously. I am sure Gordon and Sue are quite happy that we are contributing so much to the forum, particularly as we seem to have generated a fair amount of interest in these postings. Keep up the the good work.

Good wishes in making that choice today.

Brad

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Re: Vintage VE2000GG 12 string - my experience

Postby Sue » Fri Apr 04, 2014 10:58 am

Hi Brad, Oldbones,

we're delighted that you two are posting so often - I'm sure the discussion will be of interest to many others also considering purchasing either of those guitars.

The forum has a good many visitors, sadly however, most just read it rather than take the time to post so carry on the good work.

Sue
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Re: Vintage VE2000GG 12 string - my experience

Postby Oldbones » Fri Apr 04, 2014 6:13 pm

Sue wrote:Hi Brad, Oldbones .... we're delighted that you two are posting so often ... so carry on the good work. Sue

Thanks Sue. I was beginning to worry in case I was blathering too often and too much. As a guitar player I'm not in the same league as many on this forum, but I do try to make a few comments or start the odd thread or two which others might find interesting or useful. I've also greatly enjoyed swapping ideas and experiences with Brad who seems to share many of the same musical inclinations as myself. And for me, that's been a huge plus as a result of joining this forum. It's also good to think that maybe just once or twice one of the guitarists who has inspired me for so many years may ponder upon something I've added into his forum.

BRC wrote:I am now looking forward to your final decision. I certainly don't have any regrets about my choice - albeit twice ...... Good wishes in making that choice today.

Brad, as I explained in my PM, the guitar I have opted for is the Vintage VE8000PB. In a few weeks I'll post a full review here. I'll also upload a demo on Youtube. Mine won't be anywhere near the standard of Paul Brett's own demo (not with my rheumaticy old bones and dodgey left hand) - but the enthusaism will be there. Nevertheless I hope to provide some good detailed pictures and sound samples.
It isn't how fast you can play that counts - it's that you only play as fast as you need to play that is important.
Silence can be as eloquent as sound.

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Re: Vintage VE2000GG 12 string - my experience

Postby BRC » Fri Apr 04, 2014 7:23 pm

Oldbones,

Sorry if I missed your PM (?).

This has been a stressful few days so I can quite believe I have skipped a few words here and there.

I look forward to your appraisal, in due course. In the meantime I am getting on with settling in the 'new' new VE2000GG-12 which, based on the first one, should take a couple of weeks to ease in and feel just right. This weekend I have some fairly heavy gardening work to look forward to so will have little time to pick the instrument up.

I shall leave matters in abeyance for a while, unless someone has any comment to make or require of me.

Good playing. Enjoying the playing is far more important than seeking a high level of expertise.

Brad

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Re: Vintage VE2000GG 12 string - my experience

Postby Oldbones » Sat Apr 05, 2014 7:44 am

BRC wrote:Enjoying the playing is far more important than seeking a high level of expertise.

Excellent advice and an excellent philosophy.
It isn't how fast you can play that counts - it's that you only play as fast as you need to play that is important.
Silence can be as eloquent as sound.

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Re: Vintage VE2000GG 12 string - my experience

Postby BRC » Thu May 01, 2014 10:00 am

I thought it about time I gave an update on matters as I have now had the replacement VE2000GG-12 for 4 weeks.

Replacement
This has settled down very well and I am back to enjoying playing the 12 string. Nothing has changed my mind about the quality, tone, playability and the exceptional value for money. I know 'Oldbones' has given his review of the Paul Brett 12 stringer and I am pleased that it is very much to his liking. I have added some further comment/questions under that thread.

I am of course in the questionably fortunate position of having been able to play two VE2000GGs side by side and compare to see if there is any variation in the above mentioned aspects/qualities. The straight answer is 'yes there was variation, however, this was only cosmetically. The first guitar front had an interesting grain appearance - not completely even, though nonetheless aesthetically pleasing. The replacement has a much more even grain over the entire top surface. That is it - that is the extent of the variation. Everything else is, to my ear and eye and touch, undiscernibly without variation. All my guitars are kept in a reasonable stable temperature of around 22oC, which should help.

I add that is something that should be expected with all models of a particular guitar that is largely machine produced, though my past experiences have shown that can only too painfully not be the case. So, well done Gordon, Rob Armstrong and JHS. Does that qualify me for a cup of coffee invite? Oh, okay - I shall make my own!

First VE2000GG
This has now be repaired by a local luthier at very reasonable cost. It took about a week and required re jigging as the accident that befell it had caused lateral movement of the neck, almost imperceptible though clear when pointed out. A strengthening brace was added internally to give a reliably strong repair across the width of the guitar. The bracing on the belly part needed a minor amount of re-gluing. The only way of seeing the repair work is literally all done by mirrors and even then hardly noticeable to an untrained eye. Cosmetically the surface where it had been 'cracked' needs a little more work, though the luthier left that choice to me to keep the cost within sensible economic reach.

Has this made a difference to the sound and playing of the guitar? I have given the guitar to my eldest son, who could not afford to buy such a guitar, though made sure I gave it a thorough workout first and can honestly say it would be very, very difficult (if not impossible) to tell the two guitars apart. My son said he will get a friend to carry out the cosmetic repair work, though feels the damaged area is difficult to see unless pointed out. I know it is there so probably see it as much worse than others. I suppose it is like wallpaper decorating - everybody else sees the overall decoration whereas if I have done the work I can spot all the minor flaws (and point them out) instantly.

I could not have kept the guitar as I would be concerned when performing that the damage might just reopen and fall to pieces. Even if I was performing regularly, which I don't, I would not be confident of the inevitable mistreatment that befalls instruments during travel and setting-up. Having said that the guitar has gone to someone who appreciates it. Let's hope it has a long and happy life.

Old guitars
This week I was briefly reunited with my first 12 string guitar - an EKO 12 string - that I bought in 1975 for around £50 brand new. I had used it for over 30 years before passing it on to a friend (gratis) who recently bought a Takamine 12 stringer. He has now passed the EKO on to another friend, who asked if I would tune and set-up as necessary. This guitar shows its age by the cracked very thick clear lacquer that was used on these guitars, though structurally the body is in very good condition - which is more than I can say for myself. I made very minor adjustment to the bridge on the high strings side and restrung the thin G string (only because it had been put on the opposite way round to all the other strings). That was it - I had a little play, both quiet and a good bashing - and it now has a new owner. I have kept a record o all my instrument for the last 12 years and can now update the life of this EKO.

It is not the most refined instrument in the world but pricewise, value for money and playability difficult to beat - well, with the exception of the VE2000GG. Can I smell the coffee?

This will probably be the last entry I make under this thread as I feel I have said what needs to be said, though more than happy to respond to anybody who wishes me to on the instrument.

Brad

P.S. A variation I had forgotten was that the replacement guitar had a serial number on the inside on the stock - I have not been able to find a serial number on the first guitar.


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